OAS, Montreal, & Cardinal Rodriguez

I read today's dr1 news. I am very disappointed with the OAS. I agree with Cardinal Rodriguez and hope he stands firm. The conference in Montreal doesn't include DR perspectives? It is invalid. I see Canada and the US as very hypocritical. I vote that Canada go into Haiti and give the Haitians birth certificates, and bring back 100,000 Haitians into their country as residents, and also make it easier for Dominicans to get visas. I vote that since the US wants Haitians helped in the DR by Dominicans and allow residencies to Haitians who enter illegally, thus having an open border, to do the same with their Mexican border and open it up to all Mexicans entering with papers or without and give them papers and residencies. If mass deportations are human rights violations in the DR, they are also violations in the US (which some have said) and the US should stop deporting Latin Americans. If the border between Haiti and the DR is considered an unnatural border and so people are migrating naturally, so is the border with Mexico and the same goes; so then with the Caribbean and the US and the US should stop the natural migration between Puerto Rico and the DR, and between Florida anda the DR as it has always been that these islands are Taino and have freely been associated areas. How is that? No double standard.

FRom which OAS do you derive your vote? With the ability to express "opinion" and make rules comes responsibility.

I suggest you first form a nation, contribute to the efforts of the OAS, petition for mebership and then consider voting. Your views may change when you realize the responsibility that comes with the ideas you so freely opine

Tom

you are entitled to your opinions and suggestions, and I am entitled to mine. I am more aware of my responsibilities than many others. I am a member of the indigenous nations of this hemisphere which have suffered greatly from rationalized irresponsibility of others who give the appearance of "justice". There is no greater injustice than that done in the name of justice. (Gandhi) Would you like to discuss the responsibilities that come with your suggestions and opinions, and mine? That might indeed be helpful to all. It is easy to tell somebody else what they should do; but what responsibilities do we have when we steer somebody this way or that?

I don't differ with you on your rationale, or your opinion, simply stated that if you wish to vote in the voting process of the Organization of American States, I suggest it be done by a member nation, not someone who feels that have the "right" to do so from past actions.

The old story, if you want to belong to my club, obey the rules and pay the dues. There are much more sensible ways to get your point across then criticising the actions of others.

As far as your positions and "research," you may give them much credence, others ......it's an individual opinion

Interesting enough I have no view nor pre concived ideas I guess on the fact that Canadians and Americans meet on the Haitian Immigration issue in the DR. THis is maybe an obvious sign that the DR didn't do enough anyway. Where I do have a problem though is when I see a cardinal stating that the DR can't do more for Haitians just because the DR have done much more to Haitians than any other country in the world. I thought the religion and its representants was to walk the talk beyond pariochal considerations. Pascal

Acoiris

Before we become embroiled in another war, let me try and make something clear. I agree with most of your posts and positions, I just do not agree with your opinions of how and why certain things should be resolved.

You have a very strong opinion that indigenous people of almost all countries (Especially the US) have been abused, I tend to disagree in SOME areaa. This is not the crux of the issue though.

You often criticise the governments of countries, OAS etc in an attempt at promoting change, it just doesn't happen that way. The average reader has to start with grass roots organizations and build a base of power, engage political groups etc to even have these organizations listen to them

Yes, many things in this world need change, but lets try a pragmatic view and not jump up on that soapbox and criticise everyone without providing a workable solution. And to the inevietable question, NO I do not have a good answer other than the way I go about change.

I like Bobby Kennedy's method of "one man" When the massacre took place in Chiapas Mexico, we found a small plane aflew in what supplies we could, We could have picketed, criticised etc and maybe received Govt help, but instead we chose to DO something.

In July, we raised money for 3 ambulances, filled them with Meds, drove them in a convoy to Texas, defied US Treasury and crossed into Mexico and shipped them from Tampico to Cuba, just do it.

When Georges went through the DR last year, I couldn't find a plane that would make economic sense, so I went to diffferent hospitals "begging," then flew commercial to the DR and rented a 4x4, taking my supplies to the interior, just do it.

Just my method

Tom

Tom, first of all, I didn't mean an official vote. That is just an expression. second, I appreciate what you do. We just had a bread sale in my church this weekend to go toward the mission we are doing in the DR, so it is not that I am doing nothing. I work with the Church, and Cardinal Rodriguez is my superior. The Montreal meeting, if it truly is going to happen without giving DR representation, will be to me invalid. It is an old American saying, "No taxation without repressentation." US democracy is actually modeled on the Iroquois Confederacy and I stand by it, though today's parties are not practicing it. The early colonists had some good ideas; Thomas Jefferson is one of my heroes, though flawed; and Ben Franklin's sayings are still my mottoes too, though they are rejected by capitalists. But it is true that the equality that is theoretically an American ideal had, and has, exceptions - Indians and Afro-Americans, as well as Latinoes. Nobody is perfect but we are not excused from trying our best. I do not believe that White makes right. I believe we are all God's beloved children. There are clubs that I don't want to belong to. re: criticizing the actions of others: aren't you doing that to me? Isn't the OAS doing that to the DR? Again, no double standards.

I don't know of any clubs you belong to, so I can safely say I know of none that I don't wish to belong to. OAS, I believ in it, support it and feel it necessary. I do believe they are way off track on the Dominican/Haitian Issue, but simply criticising them will do nothing. You need to start at the very base worker and move up through the politicos to have any impact.

I believe what you are doing is very good, we just have different approaches to acheive the same goals, and often rub one another the wrong way on our journey to the same place

Tom

Tom,

It's funny but most of my friends from other developing countries are always rather suspicious of such orgs. like the OAS and the UN. I mention this not for any type of debate, but because it is really amazing how perceptions can be so different.

I agree with you on your comment re the OAS latest position on the Dominican-Haitian situation. Interestingly enough, my husband and I had a good friend over for dinner this past weekend. He happens to work for his country's Embassy here in Wash. DC. In the past he also worked for his country's mission to OAS. When we started to talk about OAS' position on DR/Haiti, he rolled off his eyes and you could see the disgust expression on his face. With a lot of sarcasm he said, "well Natasha, one way or the other they want to get you. You have not pay your dues and you're the fastest growing ecomony in the world." Now, I will not get into the meaning or validity of this comment on this forum, but it is rather interesting to hear something like that from a seasoned diplomat.

Regards,

Natasha

I have been told that the web site for the OAS report is: although, as an Indian, I am skeptical too, I am of the school that believes that the best way to deal is to work with them, not meaning to agree, but meaning be a member, as Tom says, to have a vote. They are here and must be reckoned with. We aim toward a unified America working with each other. Gandhi style, and Martin Luther King style. There are ways to help both the Haitians and the DR; and helping one at the expense of the other is not the way to do it.