Dominican History and heritage

[Bayx-**]

A lot of Dominicans do have a problem with their heritage. They don’t want to admit that there are some African roots in their heritage. The majority think of themselves as mulato Indian & and white mix. If they are just Indian & white mix….how comes there is so many African look alike?

Pichardo this question is for you?

Isn't it true that Trujillo gave the Jewish some land in Puerto Plata because he wanted the race to mix with white….he hated his skin color and also hated that his grandmother was black?

I saw a documentary years ago on the Christopher colon issue. At that time there was no evidence that his bones were kept in DR as Spain claims they have the bones also. If both countries claim they have his bones how are they going to prove it. There is no scientific evidence to prove that either country have his bones.

[Chip]

Originally Posted by Bayx-**

A lot of Dominicans do have a problem with their heritage. They don’t want to admit that there are some African roots in their heritage. The majority think of themselves as mulato Indian & and white mix. If they are just Indian & white mix….how comes there is so many African look alike?

The fact is Pichardo is wrong in his baseless assumption. While there is a very considerable Taino component per recent DNA results amoung the general Dominican population, the African component only naturally should be stronger. It is ludicrous to suggest otherwise.

Also, Hillbilly's thread just about says it all.

[Hillbilly]

Our friend PICHARDO also errs in the population estimates. I do believe current estimates place the Taino population closer to the 300-400,000 mark....

However, one of my points was that the incredible mix of Indian (Taino?Carib?Siboney?)
with Spanish (Spanish + Arab in a good possibility), and Blacks, then adding More Spanish to the mixture, the Haitians (mulattoes and blacks)...must have created a truly amazing DNA....and beautiful people, too.

As for the bones issue, I love to tell my students about the fact that "dispensations" were granted in medieval times to families that wanted to bury a person in more than one place. I have no doubt that this happened with the Admiral, and is reinforced by the fact that there are no bones above the hip in the box in Santo Domingo. I kid them about how we got the butt (culo) and Seville got the head. Some day some researcher will find that paper in a dark and musty file...

One of the issues is that the Columbus presence in that box is Dominican Dogma, and not scientific fact. This could have been established way back in the early 1990s when I was in communication with a professor from the University of California Los Angeles (I think!!) who was a leading expert on DNA analysis of bones...he was going to come here to look at the bones and compare them with the ones in Seville.

However, I was told in no uncertain terms that those were Colombus' bones and not bother with anything else. So no science.

HB

[catcherintherye]

I've enjoyed reading this thread, and I wouldn't dream of posting any opinion, since those posting obviously have much more knowledge about this subject than I do. I just wanted to express my appreciation for the interesting information.

[bienamor]

Originally Posted by Hillbilly

Our friend PICHARDO also errs in the population estimates. I do believe current estimates place the Taino population closer to the 300-400,000 mark....

However, one of my points was that the incredible mix of Indian (Taino?Carib?Siboney?)
with Spanish (Spanish + Arab in a good possibility), and Blacks, then adding More Spanish to the mixture, the Haitians (mulattoes and blacks)...must have created a truly amazing DNA....and beautiful people, too.

As for the bones issue, I love to tell my students about the fact that "dispensations" were granted in medieval times to families that wanted to bury a person in more than one place. I have no doubt that this happened with the Admiral, and is reinforced by the fact that there are no bones above the hip in the box in Santo Domingo. I kid them about how we got the butt (culo) and Seville got the head. Some day some researcher will find that paper in a dark and musty file...

One of the issues is that the Columbus presence in that box is Dominican Dogma, and not scientific fact. This could have been established way back in the early 1990s when I was in communication with a professor from the University of California Los Angeles (I think!!) who was a leading expert on DNA analysis of bones...he was going to come here to look at the bones and compare them with the ones in Seville.

However, I was told in no uncertain terms that those were Colombus' bones and not bother with anything else. So no science.

HB

Was there not also a Claim once by Cuba that they had the bones? so that would give us a 3 way split on columbus. Just remember hearing this somewhere.

[AmericanSentiment]

I would love to read other sources in Dominican text books that are taught in school there that can say other than what I am hearing and from what I posted.

Here are a few sources that I will post.

Also later I will post some of the text quoted in the books.


"The Dominican Republic: A national history"
By Frank Moya Pons

"Why the cocks fight: Dominicans, Hatians & the struggle for Hispaniola"
By Michele Wucker

Colonial Sato Domingo, a guide publish in the Dominican Republic

Also Hamlet Hermann,
A writer, political analyst & former government minister in Sato Domingo.



Sources for the Tainos (As I have read in history before, there are no more Taino survivors they were all killed in the 16th century)

For a Native history of Hispaniola read

"The Tainos: Rise & Fall of the people who greeted Columbus"
By Irving Rouse

Columbus Outpost among the Tianos: Spain & America at La Isabela 1493-1498
By Kathleen Degan & Jose Maria Cruxent

[suarezn]

...and the people who seem to worry so much about race are the people who come from other countries where racism is a way of life.

Dominicans don't worry so much about this...yes we may say "I'm not black, I'm indio claro...", but it means nothing in the grand scheme of things. Most of our families are mixed (i.e. in my family alone we run the gamut from very white, Scandinavian look alike to very dark, just came from Congo types)...and we all like each other, get along and race is never an issue.

[Chip]

Originally Posted by AmericanSentiment

Sources for the Tainos (As I have read in history before, there are no more Taino survivors they were all killed in the 16th century)

This is incorrect, and more than likely the persevered as a separate community until the 19th century until loosing their language. However, many Tainos words and customs remain today and are an integral part of Dominican culture. See the following thread:

Tainos in the DR?

[A.Hidalgo]

Originally Posted by AmericanSentiment

I would love to read other sources in Dominican text books that are taught in school there that can say other than what I am hearing and from what I posted.

Here are a few sources that I will post.

Also later I will post some of the text quoted in the books.


"The Dominican Republic: A national history"
By Frank Moya Pons

"Why the cocks fight: Dominicans, Hatians & the struggle for Hispaniola"
By Michele Wucker

Colonial Sato Domingo, a guide publish in the Dominican Republic

Also Hamlet Hermann,
A writer, political analyst & former government minister in Sato Domingo.



Sources for the Tainos (As I have read in history before, there are no more Taino survivors they were all killed in the 16th century)

For a Native history of Hispaniola read

"The Tainos: Rise & Fall of the people who greeted Columbus"
By Irving Rouse

Columbus Outpost among the Tianos: Spain & America at La Isabela 1493-1498
By Kathleen Degan & Jose Maria Cruxent

Some have injected good answers to your questions, but looking at the list of books you have quoted above especially the one from Pons, did you think from this forum you were going to get better answers? Or maybe you wanted to stir the shyt up?

[AmericanSentiment]

Originally Posted by Chip

This is incorrect, and more than likely the persevered as a separate community until the 19th century until loosing their language. However, many Tainos words and customs remain today and are an integral part of Dominican culture. See the following thread:

Tainos in the DR?

I would love to know the sources and historians for this information.

Also someone posted to close this thread, I don't see any reason to close.. My intention is not cause a fight but to learn more about the Dominican history. No insult to anyone if you are offended