Interesting piece written by a Dominican writer in CNN's "Latino in America" section

ExtremeR · #1 10-22-2009, 01:10 PM

This is a really interesting article talking about the census classification in the US, and I found myself agreeing with a lot of the points she makes.

Quote:

Many used "Latino" and "Hispanic" interchangeably, unsure about the differences, but rejected Spanish altogether because not doing so would be the same as an American calling themselves "English."

Link: Commentary: 'But what's a Latino?' - CNN.com

Discuss.

bienamor · #2 10-22-2009, 03:03 PM

OK so Hispanic or Latino does not cover all of the variations for those people that want their own category. I would maybe agree but there is not a separate box for Italian, Irish, German, Greek, Jewish, etc. we all all lumped under Caucasian. I'm sure that some would like to use their heritage. So whats the big deal.

Find a box you like and check it.

AlterEgo · #3 10-22-2009, 04:06 PM

Excellent article. I sent the link to some of my family, and our Dominican niece who lives in Oklahoma wrote back that she often has that dilemma when she fills paperwork for her 2 year old son [his dad is American]. What shocked me is that she said the baby is definitely NOT white (her emphasis, not mine), but that's what the employees where she's filling these papers always tells her to check off. Now this girl is a white Dominican, a natural blonde as a child and still has dark blonde/lt brown hair, and very fair skin and Caucasian hair and features. She and her brother look like typical Americans. [My kids look more ethnic than they do.] Her husband is a white American.

I always understood that when latinos called someone 'white' they meant non-Latino.

I know the mods don't like race postings, so if this is offensive feel free to delete it.

dv8 · #4 10-22-2009, 05:57 PM

miesposo is dominican and so white he can easily pass for a so called "caucasian".
interestingly his ancestors are a mixture of cultures and races: cuban, puertorican, jewish, haitian, spanish, italian and few other european countries. there were and there are all colours in his family as well although admittedly most of the living members are light skinned.

minerva_feliz · #5 10-22-2009, 09:42 PM

I also read some of the comments people posted below the article.

As globalization and migration patterns continue, I think it's important for the census to methodologically take into account reality versus people's perceptions. And it's not just ok to throw our arms up in the air and say, 'who cares, we're all Americans...' because the playing field is not quite level yet. It is important to be able to put people into groups by nationality, race, ethnicity, etc. to have a more objective understanding to social problems and to come up with solutions for them. People should not strive for a colorblind society anyway, as differences are what make us unique and should be celebrated in a positive way.

Instead of just having "boxes" or categories for race, or for ethnicity, such as black or latino, I think a new approach needs to be taken. For skin color, instead of asking people to associate themselves with black or white, why not have a series of actual colors samples (like the ones they have in stores for paint colors), and put a code (could use numbers, letters of alphabet) by each color. People pick the code that is literally closest to the color of their skin. I think this seems more objective because things are being measured for in the United States. Someone who is white or indio in the DR might be called black in Mexico, but in the U.S. it could be standardized into a code based objectively on the color of skin.

The article brings up important points about people not liking their ethnicity being so simplified as it may not describe what the feel is the full story of who they are. So I think two types of ethnicities should be measured, perceived and prescribed. Perceived would be the person can pick all categories that they feel actively describe them, not just one, but should be things that they personally identify with. Prescribed would be based on the person identifying, if they can, their parents, grandparents and up to great-grandparents nationality. If all of someone's ancestors were born in the U.S., at that point they are not even a 1st, 2nd or 3rd generation immigrant, and perhaps at that point they could be considered just a "regular American", like a generationalized (that's not even a real word!?) American whose family's origins are not important for census purposes. I guess the question is, at what point does it stop becoming relevant (for statistical purposes), where your ancestors came from? Maybe that's why white people don't care to put Irish or German American, because to them it doesn't matter, they are "just Americans". At some point, can't Latinos become "just Americans" then?

I think the U.S. needs to invest some major funds in overhauling the census and making it technologically advanced. It would be a good investment considering the the outlook for the future of a country made up of immigrants. All of this additional information might seem like a nightmare of matrices, but the census needs to step up by hiring more of those out of work social science majors

. If there is money to hurdle stuff at the moon, surely there is money to do all of that somewhere.

POPNYChic · #6 10-23-2009, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bienamor

OK so Hispanic or Latino does not cover all of the variations for those people that want their own category. I would maybe agree but there is not a separate box for Italian, Irish, German, Greek, Jewish, etc. we all all lumped under Caucasian. I'm sure that some would like to use their heritage. So whats the big deal.

Find a box you like and check it.

Your statement fails to take into account that in Latin America race isnt just about being from "x" country. Most Latinos are of several different races.

The census gives you the option to be either an "Other", nonclassified thing that makes you feel like a non-person, OR you can box yourself into a ridiculosuly innacurate "white" or "black" category.

Americans views on race are extremely polarized as people still dont really mix very freuqently to this day. Its considered "new" in the u.s. whereas in Latin America we've been mixing all nillywilly since the 1400's.

BIG difference. How can you just check the box you like when the people who invented the boxes didnt take you into account and thus there IS no box that describes you?

mountainannie · #7 10-23-2009, 07:34 PM

At the us government website for the census, hispanics and latinos are NOT characterized as race....

Population by Race and Hispanic or Latino Origin for the United States: 1990 and 2000 (PHC-T-1)

the "races" which some people deny exist at all... are confine to caucasian, indian, and asian... with subtle variations within them...

You can see from the questionaire
on the long form
http://www.census.gov/dmd/www/pdf/d02p.pdf

Note that they have not even got a box for "suspicious looking arab guy"

that census.gov got very sensitive and subtle around south east asian issues with lots of subtle distinctions there.. probably due to those "conflicts overseas" that we had mid century.

So I would be interested to hear what Dominicans would want added to be culturally sensitive? Certainly Afro Lation Caribbean is not going to get a lot of votes. Hispanic Caribbean... you, Cuba, PR?

I think that assumption is that there is some sort of shared culture among the former Colonies of Spain... which certainly seems true from the point of view of the government and customs... looking from the OUTSIDE ..

But really, are you Dominicans More like Guatemalans than Jamaicans?

(ducking now to avoid rotten eggs)

mountainannie · #8 10-23-2009, 07:41 PM

note question five under which the Latinos and Hispanic can state which nation they are from.....

also note that on the form under race, you are free to check AS MANY as apply.

mountainannie · #9 10-23-2009, 07:45 PM

http://www.census.gov/dmd/www/pdf/d61a.pdf

in the short form as well, Latinos are given the option of country of origin

everyone may check as many racial groups as apply.

bienamor · #10 10-23-2009, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by POPNYChic

Your statement fails to take into account that in Latin America race isnt just about being from "x" country. Most Latinos are of several different races.

The census gives you the option to be either an "Other", nonclassified thing that makes you feel like a non-person, OR you can box yourself into a ridiculosuly innacurate "white" or "black" category.

Americans views on race are extremely polarized as people still dont really mix very freuqently to this day. Its considered "new" in the u.s. whereas in Latin America we've been mixing all nillywilly since the 1400's.

BIG difference. How can you just check the box you like when the people who invented the boxes didnt take you into account and thus there IS no box that describes you?

Ok new box heines 57 ok. being part german, english, and native american believe me it aint no big deal. what do they have in the dr for census boxes. I dont remember do you

Well from what Anni wrote, nothing more to add, just put your country down.