Dominican Education in Crisis

[georgea67]

Along with this damage to our school came the doing away with customs, so off came the nun’s habits, and often times we saw the priests in shorts and shirts without Roman collars. We were supposed to call them Fr. Bob or Fr. Russ. The nuns with knee-length dresses who had formerly worn habits were now teaching us sex ed. Familiarity breads contempt, but not in the New Church
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georgea

http://www.dr1.com/forums/newreply.p...ote=1&p=669642.

[catcherintherye]

RHM,
I noticed this thread started out in the right direction back in August and September, but was side-tracked by Pichardos's thread on a similar topic. That thread went around in circles and died an unpleasant death. I'd like to see this one come back to life.

There were plenty of good ideas on the other thread, but I think people were a little leery of the intentions of the OP, and perhaps felt their input wasn't leading to any useful conclusion.

I believe that many of the contributors were on to something, with many great ideas being developed, and I think those basic ideas might do well and flourish here.

So, if MikeFisher, LaTeacher, BushBaby, and all the rest, want to follow through with their thoughts, perhaps this is the thread on which to do it. Of course, Margaret is always welcome, and I'm sure I missed a few other major players from the other thread as well.

[catcherintherye]

I realized I should have mentioned all of the major contributors in the other thread if I was going mention a few, so:
MaineGirl, BronxBoy, socuban,, A. Hidalgo, notlurking, Lambada, theforceinme, Bob Saunders, olddog, Leromero, and did I mention Margaret?
I apologize if I missed anyone or misspelled any names. I'm going on my very fragile memory.
Of course, Margaret is always welcome!

[bob saunders]

Originally Posted by LaTeacher

maybe it has something to do with the fact that in one week, there is ALMOST ALWAYS one day with no class - teacher's meetings, rain, holiday, araganania (laziness, i'm not sure if that's correct, but it's what we call it here in my spanglish speaking household). or maybe it's because there are only FOUR valid hours of class and students are given a thirty minute "recreo." or maybe it's because there is no focus on the 4 basics: spanish, math, science and social studies.

has anyone noticed how many classes are REQUIRED by the board of ed? in elementary school there is: espanol (which is divided into: reading, writing, spelling, handwriting and speaking... but only given one period (about 40 minutes) a day, math, social studies (both history AND geography), science... and now, the "extras" formacion humana (religion), art, civics (isn't this really part of social studies?), gym class (how do you have gym with no playground?), computers (even if the school has NO computers), from 5th grade on BOTH ENGLISH AND FRENCH (neither of which are given the proper time or effort to actually learn them) in high school there are THIRTEEN classes that dominican students take in ONE semester - including "agroeconomia" and "comercio".

I think the thing that most bothers me about these studies that recently came out is that they only focus on PUBLIC schools, but really the problem extends to the private sector as well. The teachers in the public school are typically more qualified than teachers in the private and overwhelmingly better paid that private school (let's all forget about bilingual where teachers get paid, mostly, for speaking english). the problem is an all around curriculum program, mixed in with lack of interest or a culture of education.

In Yris's private school there are around 500 kids from pre-kinder to grade 7. Morning and afternoon. 5 classes of 1 hour each with a 15 minute snack break. Largest class is 32 students - one teacher and an assistant. All pre-school/kinder have a teacher and assistant. Physical fitness classes twice a week, small school yard(concrete 35 ft by 80 ft) but adaquate for exercise and ball games. She has a principal with a masters degree, 3 teachers with the 4 year BA in teaching, and the rest with the 2 year basica. 15 computers - keyboarding, MS Word and basic computer skills are taught- no internet. Teacher's salary vary but you are correct, most make less than Public system, in fact half work in the public system teaching night classes. English teacher's knowledge of English not as good as it should be but she is a very capable teacher and highly interested, which is why we are paying for her to take ESL Summer classes at Queens University in Kingston, Ontario this summer. Lots of room for improvement but progress is slowly but surely being made.

[LaTeacher]

Bob - sounds like your wife is on the right track. sadly a lot of private schools are opened as businesses and not as educational endeavors (ie: the people who open them aren't exactly interested in education). and ANyone can open a school with just a little paperwork!

i'm glad that your english teacher is interested in learning more, that's the real key to being a good teacher. the desire to keep learning.

hopefully this thread will be more productive than the other. i noticed the OP to that thread had opened a new thread and no one responded. karma, i tell ya.

[MikeFisher]

and this one shows us again the same missing:
teachers.
we need to get a bunch of better trained teachers to better the results of the public and private school system. and i am not attacking the teachers, noap, they do what they can or what they've been taught to do.
2 weeks ago i've been with my pre school 5 years old in a discussion about his homework, mostly checked by the mother, but as often as i am home in the afternoons i join in and we do that the funny way so he enjoys to learn at home. the discussion came up when i saw that the homework he want to start with me to do know been given for the prior day, not for today, so i asked why he did not do his yesterday's homework. the boy asured me he did not have homework yesterday, and this one been given this morning to do today. the date in his book been the date from the prior day. handwritten by the teacher. next day he brought his new homework and again the handwritten date by the teacher been the date from the prior day. so i saw that my boy told me right, i put a note to the teacher under his homework with the little hint about the real date of today. at least the next day i saw in the book that the teacher been checking the homeworks, because my little note been signed with "gracias".
my boy is in a private school, yes.
if the teacher is not even focused on the actual Date for 2 days in a row, how focused is that lady when teaching writings, some new numbers for the little ones aso? IMO to change anything to the better in the DR educational system we have to better the education of teachers. of course such can not be done in some months, it is a process taking several years because a bigger effect will be felt, but it has to be done. otherwise one day we may have enough classrooms and maybe the needed materials, but the boys have to teach themselves their maths 'cause there's no teacher available enought knowledgeable in math to teach a 2nd or 3rd grade,
great topic
should always stay on, that subject will stick with the country for a long while.
Mike

[catcherintherye]

hopefully this thread will be more productive than the other. i noticed the OP to that thread had opened a new thread and no one responded. karma, i tell ya. LaTeacher


I think just by not focusing on the impractical and improbable scheme of implementing a digital classroom for every community, this thread can be a hundred times more productive, and more interesting.

Although I'm a high school teacher in the US I do not have the practical knowledge of what the DR system consists of now, nor what is needed to change. I just know that many Dominican kids are not getting anywhere near what they need to compete in the world economy.

I don't know if this situation is the result of any conscious policy or not, but it has certainly served the powers that be very well, up to this point.

If the maintenance of an inadequate educational system that results in an uneducated and subservient under-class is an official or de facto policy, then that information should become a very important consideration for anyone attempting to change the system.

[LaTeacher]

it's true - the teachers are lacking in some very vital areas. but to change the teacher training would be a complete overhaul of the dominican system - not just educational. the universities who accept payment for grades (and please don't deny that it happens) or push students through "just because they paid for the class" isn't going to help anyone in the future. the very same teachers in the university would need to step up their game and get with the program - show up for class and actually teach something useful instead of showing up late, or not at all and then gossiping with the students. there needs to be an introduction to (more) modern teaching philosophy's and more creative thought happening AMONGST THE TEACHERS. if the teachers have no creative, logical or critical thinking skills, how do we expect them to impart those skills to their students?

remember, though, that the lack of these skills isn't just a burden on teachers. last weekend some friends of mine went to a "workshop" with their employer - a group of engineers and construction workers alike - where they were asked to complete some brain teasers and critical thinking puzzles and (my friends included) told me HOW HARD it was and how they couldn't even figure out where to start. it was the first time one of these friends acknowledged to me his real lack of those skills. i think it scared him.

mike - just because your sons teacher didn't know the date doesn't mean that she's not interested. i often forget the date, it's probably the last thing on my mind most days as i'm more concerned to get the more important things taken care of. when you son stops bringing home homework or is showing real deficiencies, then i would worry.

but your point brings up another very valid point. remember people, it's NOT JUST THE PUBLIC SYSTEM THAT IS IN CRISIS. the private schools ARE JUST AS BAD - even the really expensive ones that are supposed to be BETTER. they're not. in fact, the teachers who work there spend THEIR days complaining about how little they get paid and not really focused on how MUCH the kids should be learning. sad fact. but i'd send my kid to public school over an overpriced waste anyday (but that's a personal opinion and not meant to start an argument, everyone has a different situation/philosophy and i'm by no means the end all on dominican educatioN)

[cobraboy]

I had dinner with a bunch of folks who run a large private school here in Jarabacoa. I asked them about gubmint involvement in their school, and they said it was minimal, they rarely hear from any gubmint office.

So I sincerely ask this: IF their experience is common with all private schools in the DR, how does the gubmint accuartely say only 10% of Dominicans graduate from HS? There seem to be a BUNCH of private schools wherever I travel.

What % of Dominican kids go to private schools?

[Theforceinme]

Ah, lovely thread. I wish I had more to contribute. I am Dominican and I teach, but my experience with public or private schools is somewhat limited. I teach mostly at an institute, where students mostly want to learn since it is a) expensive and b) totally voluntary for them to start classes.

I did teach in one small private school, and I can definitely agree with two things already mentioned here: the teachers are under qualified and it is run as a business, and not as a school. Take, for example, my situation: At that small private school the administration wanted me to teach biology, chemistry, maths and English to the kids. I told them I was not qualified to do this, at least, I didn't feel qualified. They insisted, offered better pay, and I tried my best to teach them.

I later found out that they didn't care I didn't know how to teach these subjects, they just wanted their students to stop complaining to rich mommy and daddy that they were not receiving biology, chem or maths. YES, THEY WERE NOT RECEIVING THESE CLASSES BEFORE!! I was amazed.

Of course, the children's interest was less than rock bottom, and the administration, instead of helping me to force them, did the exact opposite. I sent a letter to the children's parents warning them that if their child did not take an active interest, they would fail that year. The school refused to deliver the letters and proceeded to fire me and put all the blame on the failed school year on me. Like I cared...

I left that school on pretty bad terms since I told them what I thought of them...

In any case, those CHILDREN, who will soon be the owners of Banco Central, Banco Popular and Telemicro... well, I won't mention names but I feel SAD that these uneducated idiots will be leaders in some of our major corporations. They can't even sum their fingers without help.

Is this the students fault? Partly... I think sometimes we blame the teachers and the government a lot but as someone mentioned, this is a cultural thing. Maybe it doesn't matter what the government tries, it is the population that needs to change its habits.

Unfortunately, it seems that the smarter we are, the less we reproduce. Dumb ppl have 13 kids, smart ones use birth control. Super-over-generalizing of course, but maybe there is a grain of truth there. In any case, seems like we're only getting dumber. Dumb consumers... the US must love it. Imports are up, after all.