Buying Land without a title

[Cronin_Andrea]

My wife and I are about to buy a small peice of land in La Isabella to build on and potentially live in part time. We have bought land before in DR, all has been in Santiago and all have come with title. So this is new ground for us. This peice of land from what I understand, was given to the original owners by the govt by virtue of their living on the land. They then sold it via contract to the current owners who are planning on selling it to us the same way.

The sellers are recommended people but not "friends" of my wife's family and the lawyer making the contract is also family. They say this is a common way of buying and selling land. Anyone hear of this before or buy this way?

Thanks in advance.

[carina]

I would never buy land that does not have a title.
Without the title you can never know who the real owner is, and it is not you if you don´t have it, contract or no contract.'
Be careful.

[Robert]

Of course they are telling you this is common.
I guess they are all getting a piece of YOUR cash.

Sorry, but in my opinion, only a complete fool would buy property here without a clear title.

[Dominicanscotti]

Be very careful

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Cronin_Andrea

They say this is a common way of buying and selling land. Anyone hear of this before or buy this way?

Thanks in advance.

Yes, it is common for ground that is government owned and has never before been titled. I am not an expert on the process but we have done this twice. Because it is common, it is not by definition a safe transaction however. Some years ago in Azua, the government titled the lands there and everyone who laid claim to a piece of land, had to prove that they occupied the land, and that there are no other claims to the land. I do not know whether this is common in all cases, but in that case, the person with right of use could not claim more than 10 tareas. The document that is then issued is called a Certification from the Instituto Agrario Dominicana, and this document describes the land and also certifies who the 'occupier' is of the land. We also have a permission to construct on the land that we bought. When the Government gets around to doing the paperwork to title the land, this occupier should then receive title. This is not a deslinde, and the delinde process must then also be done.

In our case, we are working with the local land owner's association, who has been petitioning the government to hand over the titles, according to some prescribed procedure that seemed very strange to me. However, they have now received the authority to go ahead and finally do the paperwork for title (not more than 10 tareas per occupier). So, we have our certificacion and the title will be forthcoming as the paperwork is being done. Working with the local association has been a lesson in 'communal' thinking and my Presidente drinking skills have vastly improved...

I must tell you up front that when we decided to buy this, our attorney just about disowned us and really did not want to know.. But we felt that our community roots in the area were strong enough at the time, to risk this crazy process. We also were not investing anything that we would be materially hurt if we lost the money. We also have not done any improvements besides a fence and some fruit trees.

I don't gamble (in casino's that is). But this was a gamble and only because certain community relationships were in place, did we decide to do it.

To summarise,
- The process of titling the land had already been started and the results at that time were positive,
- We were an accepted part of the community and dues-paying members of the local association that was spearheading the titling of the land,
- This association was well founded with local land occupiers and they were committed to the process,
- We could bring in attorneys that knew the process of receiving titles and in that way, assist the local association and look after ourselves,
- It was clear that we could, with very little trouble and with community support, receive the certification of occupancy.
- There was no other way to purchase land in the area.

For us, it is paying off. But, I would hesitate to do it again and I will certainly never tell anyone that this is either a comfortable, or a safe process.

[arturo]

Originally Posted by Robert

Of course they are telling you this is common.
I guess they are all getting a piece of YOUR cash.

Sorry, but in my opinion, only a complete fool would buy property here without a clear title.

You would be very foolish to buy land ANYWHERE without a clear title. Clear titles are not as common here as other places and this is one of several reasons why I personally have no interest in the local real estate market. The advice is to stay away from transactions without titles.

As a guideline, you can use mortgage lender rules. For example, there are strict title search and title insurance requirements. Banks have a tendency to want to protect their money.

My last glimmer of interest in real estate investments in this country flickered out after I did some preliminary research into title insurance. I decided that I am more risk-averse than I previously knew.

[Cronin_Andrea]

Thanks for the responses. We spoke to a family lawyer who is well regarded in Santiago for an extra bit of comfort. That combined with the fact that my wife's family has known these people for the 15 years they have owned and lived on the land in Isabella we are going ahead with it.

My In-laws have lived in Isabella for 5 years now, it really is a very small "campo" like town. No one there has title although it is our understanding that we can get title on the land after purchase with considerable amount of time and pesos. Its the pesos part that causes the residents not to title their land.

Mike

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Cronin_Andrea

Thanks for the responses. We spoke to a family lawyer who is well regarded in Santiago for an extra bit of comfort. That combined with the fact that my wife's family has known these people for the 15 years they have owned and lived on the land in Isabella we are going ahead with it.

My In-laws have lived in Isabella for 5 years now, it really is a very small "campo" like town. No one there has title although it is our understanding that we can get title on the land after purchase with considerable amount of time and pesos. Its the pesos part that causes the residents not to title their land.

Mike

Are you talking about La Isabella on the road to Punta Rucia? Or is there another one?

[Cronin_Andrea]

Originally Posted by Chris

Are you talking about La Isabella on the road to Punta Rucia? Or is there another one?

Yes exactly. It is the place where Columbus erected the island's first Catholic Church etc. Know it?

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Cronin_Andrea

Yes exactly. It is the place where Columbus erected the island's first Catholic Church etc. Know it?

Yes, I do. It is simply lovely out there.... Good Luck - most of us on the board consider buying without title just absolutely crazy... (Even though we've done just that, I still think we're crazy). Just make very sure that you have the history of the land documented very very well and that the documentation holds up - and that there are no prior claims on the land from other family, children, uncles, nieces, nephews, relatives of dead relatives or whoever. Otherwise just about anyone can make a claim and then the one with the most pesos/influence wins. Also, if possible, do not make any improvements before you have the title sorted. (My attorney is going to kill me for this! - The politically correct thing and best practice is to say Don't Do It!)