Dominican Men's Attitudes About Sex

[Panzanelle]

Hi! I've been reading discussions on this website for some time, but this is the first time I have posted...

I know by bringing up this topic of Domincan men's sexual attitudes I am potentially opening up to some curt or insensitive responses by some, but I am hoping that there will be some mature and intelligent people with valuable things to say in the mix. Thank you in advance! (By the way, I tried to do an archive search, but kept getting a reply that said I didn't have the minimun 4 words, but no matter how many words I put in my keyword search, I received that same message) So, I am starting my own thread.

My questions involve Dominican mens' attitudes about sex in serious long-term relationships. First let me identify what I'm NOT talking about. I am not talking about those toursist love affairs that sometimes happen. I am not talking about long-distance relationships where neither person has lived in the other's culture for any real length of time. I am not talking about young love, though I'm not opposed to it ! . I am not even talking about Dominican mens' much-talked about tendancy towards infidelity, though it is worthy of more discussion- for this conversation however, I would like to leave it out, except possibly in context of how that potentiality or that knowledge of other men's lifestyles "out there" might affect a faithful man's attitudes about sex with his partner, especially if there is any sort of conflict.

What I AM talking about are sexual attitudes in hypothetically long-term committed relationships between a gringa-ish (or European) female and a Dominicam male in the DR. It could also include Dominicana/Dominicano relationships if applicable. I will start by telling my own story, but I think it could be something other people have expereinced, too.


My Dominican boyfriend (of 7 years) and I have different attitudes about sex. He has a higher libido than me (though mine is healthy), and thinks that we should have sex everyday or at least go no more than two mornings without sex. He also thinks I should never say no. He thinks that Dominican women never say no to their husbands or partners, and that they always "want it". While I doubt that the latter is true, I think that because many women fear that their men may "stray" or start another family, it is possible that the first part is true (that they don't say no), that they could be afraid to say no to their husbands, for fear of losing him to someone else if they do.

Once we began to have a few conflicts over this issue, he sought the opinions of Dominican women he knew that had been married to the same man for a long time. They told him that they never said no to their husbands, that it was the least they could do, and one women even told him, "Whenever my husband wants it, I just spread my legs" (A quote, mind you). Of course this reenforced my boyfriend's opinion that I should always say yes, and that if I didn't, I was depriving him of something he thinks he should rightfully have. And that if I say "no" I am denying him something to which he is entitled.

Let me clarify, I have usually said yes. I like sex. I am no cold fish. But occasionally, for whatever reasons, there are those occasional times when he wants to and I don't. (Maybe it's 4 in the morning and I haven't slept enough, maybe I have something on my mind, and I'm not thinking about sex at that moment.) - In the past, whenever those tiems have arisen and I have said no, I did so gently, with compassion, and with an explanation, and later on I initiated just to show him I still think he is a sexy guy! (And too there are times when I didn't want to at first and he changed my mind). But Everybody, even men, feel this way some-times. The difference is, he doesn't see it that way. If he initiates, I am suppose to say yes, all the time. I wonder if that is him or a prodcut of his culture? He really seems to think that woemn who love theri men never say no, and no matter how gently I explain it, or how much a reassure him sexily later, that he is oppressively having to deal with an indpendent sexual being.


This brings us to an impasse. It is causing some conflicts between us, a domino affect really. Aside from this issue we have had a wonderful relationship. loving and thoughtful. We rarely argued, and when we did they were minor arguments with productive outcomes. When I don't say yes, however, he pouts and sometimes doesn't talk to me until I have sex with him, and increasingly he treats me very rudely, even losing his temper, yelling about how women shouldn't say no. As soon as I have sex with him again, he becomes my wonderful boyfriend again, loving and supportive an dvery giving nad thoughtful. All of this nevertehless feels very manipulative and very hurtful, and guess what? When he acts like this, it kills my desire.

Whenever I try to talk about it with him, he insists that he is justified in behaving badly if I am "denying" him what he is supposed to have. I think he really believes I am supposed to always say yes to him. I think he really believes (myth or not) that women who love their partners never say no. I insist that his expectations are not realistic and that my need to occasionally say 'no' should be honored and respected, as my right. I try to explain the detrimental affects on passion and love of making sex seem like a household duty, rather than something we give to each other because of love, excitement,or desire. He insists that there is nothing he can do, that he is justified in treating me rudely so long as I am not compliant, that the problem is mine, and that if I would just always say yes, like Dominican women do, we would have no problems (and indeed he is single-minded enough on this issue, that it really might solve our problems from his perspective. He's great to me when we are having sex and I never say no. But that's just not possible all the time especailly with someone with such a high libido.) He even takes a lofty attitude of how great he is to be with a woman "like me", that he can stay with me despite what he deems "my sexual problem", something that would be very normal in my culture where men and women accept that their moments of desire are not always in sinc and that they will have sex later on. The only solution he sees to this issue, is for me to decide to "change my attitude" and learn to say yes like "most women do".

The things is, it might really be the case that Dominican women don't usually say no. So how much of his expectations are real? I'm not sure what to say on a way. While there are many fine exceptions to this, I think that many if not most Dominican women do take great pride and shape much of their identities around how attractive they are to men and if they can keep their man. So maybe they dont' want to ever say no, and risk that "sexy" image they work so hard to maintain. Maybe as I said before, they are even afraid to, for fear he'll leave or find a second woman. So maybe his expectations then are realistic in the current climate of his culture. I have known men here who had one-night stands with Dominican women, and awoke to find their lovers cleaning the kitchen. Now that IS a cultural difference!! Something is behind all that.

So it is very difficult to wade though what is cultural and what is a personal attitude. In a way the result for me is the same, but it would be helpful to know anyway, to know what I am facing and how to face it. Although it is unfathomable to me that he could act this way, becasue I kno whe really really loves me, it is a unacceptabel reality for me, so I am torn.Our relationship has been so great until this machisto issue came up, but it is becoming a big one for me, sadly. The issue didn't come up until recent years, and I am at a loss.

Are there any other women out there with a subtantial relationship with a Dominican man who have faced these issues or are facign them now? What have you done to help resolve it? How have you framed it for him or tried to explain or educate him? Have you been able to fid a compromise? what worked fo ryou?




Before closing this lengthy little posting, I know that there are some who will read this and be very tempted by the topic to write derogatory remarks, or to bash Dominican men or women who have relationships with Dominican men. I have seen it so many times on these pages. Please try to practice restraint and respect that someof us would like a serious dialogue. Thanks to those who will keep the conversation on a mature level.

That having been said, if anyone has thoughtful commentsand observations to share, male female Dominican or Non-Domincan, I would appreciate very much your commentary and ideas! Social commentary about Dominican men's attitudes about sex in marriage or partnership would a plus if anybody has insight, or Dominican women's attitudes for that matter! Even outside of the immediate issues I am facing, this is an interesting topic, so I would be curious to hear what people think about all these social sexual moreys. They're all around us afterall. So I'd like to hear people's general opinions on the topic, too.

Best,
Panzanelle

[Timex]

So I'll skip the usual Welcome to DR1!
And just welcome you out of the lurking closet!

I'm an American-Mutt, married to an Dominican-American.
You looking for examples & insight, from long-term, monogamous commitments, right?

Panzanelle
Before I give my opinion to some of your questions, I have some questions for you. None of them are meant to be derogatory in any-way.
And I have no professional training in this field, 0-Nada-Zip, Ok??

If you able to answer, just Yes or No, except where indicated.

Your Boyfriend of 7 years.

Are you living together?
If so for how long?(Years)
Are you living in the DR?
If not, where?(just a country)
Is he educated?
Is he employed?

Does his employment put him in the same earning capacity as you?
Who is taking care of the finances, after the decision making? (You/Him/Both/ or are finances completely separated)

Do either of you have kids?
Any living with you?

After being around a group of your friends, does his attitude or behavior change at all?
The same question above, but when you are around a group of his friends?

Are you both, around the same age, or is there a big spread in difference?
After 7 years, do you have any assets together?
Or are they completely separated?
If the asset majority is separated, can you give a percentage to each half? (Ex:- You 80%/Him 20%)

Have you made any long term commitments to with each other?
(Life Insurance/Retirement/wedding plans/anything)

The everyday Conquistador attitude is not normal.

I am in a very committed relationship with my wife, and even though I may think about having sex, once every 7 seconds of my waking day, I could not/would not, be able to make love every single day for 7 years.
I would be the worlds biggest B/S artist if I said that.
To many things get in the way, kids/stress/sick parents, etc, etc.

Your guy may need to prove that he is your MAN, by substituting his lack of security, by physically conquering you every 24hrs.

After 7 years, a MAN, needs to feel he has accomplished something, ex: kids/house/car/a good job.
Not that he, has just spent 7yrs spinning his wheels.

I’ll wait for your answer’s.

Thanks
Tim H.

**************************************************

OK, enough of that!
In the meantime I will give you the conclusion, in the same style, of my favorite, syndicated, spiritual advisor, SAVAGE LOVE.
He is all knowing in these matters and is highly respected for his opinions!

His reply would be something like……..

Dear DSL
I have a problem with my man, wanting to please me everyday for the last 7 years.
And I want to know if this is a normal problem????
Yours Truly
Panzanelle


Dear Panzanelle

No it’s not normal!!!
Geezes lady, what friggin planet are you on! By next week we will have millions of e-mails from un-satisfied women, from all over, looking to help you get rid of YOUR problem!!!!! So just send me his e-mail, and I will forward the requests from his future partners to him.

I see you have only a couple of choices.
Dig out your whips & heels, and house-break that bad puppy!!!

And if he were to walk into the bedroom, and see you in Stilettos, a black corset, wearing a strap-on, holding a whip in one hand and a tube of love-lube in the other, commanding him, down on all fours, well he just might not be so quick to rush back for more!!!!

Go out and get a supply of your own Viagra. Recent studies show, it works for a woman’s libido, just like a man( although they change the color of the pill, & up the price, or so I am told).

Go shopping for a mistress for him together??? This way, you’ll be part of the solution. And you never know! It might open up new possibilities in the bedroom for both of you!

You could try counseling, the shorter sessions work best for men, clinical studies have proved our attention span is Rudely Interrupted every 7 seconds, with the thought of having sex! (No wonder women complain that were not listening! How insensitive of THEM!!!) And they think we come from Marz, maybe thats the problem!!!

Have you tried an Internet Porno Subscription, and teach him, how to masturbate?????

My hope is that one of the above answer’s, helps you resolve YOUR problem!
If not, I fear you will have to trade him in, for one of the older- impotent models.

Good Luck!
Yours Truly
DSL

THE ARCHIVES OF DAN SAVAGE
5yrs of weekly, on-line advice,Scroll down to COLUMNS, and click on the name SAVAGE LOVE, not the Entire Issue.

[shadInToronto]

And what else? I don't understand these posts ..... are there some specific rules for DR men and women towards sex and relationships?

Woman, whatever relationship you have with this dude, you and only you can resolve your issues ...... there are no established rules, that are applicable to DR men, which you expect this dude to comply with.

[rmary]

Hi Panzanella,

I am not involved with a Dominican man, so I really can't answer that question, but.......

I tend to agree with Shad's last paragraph (not necessarily the first). Culture does come into play in this I think, but in a real relationship, so does yours.

The North American Female in me says, no one should be forced to have sex if they don't want to. That being said, I laud you for trying to find out more about his assertions that Dominican women have sex whenever their men want them to. It shows that you are trying to understand his culture. What I find surprising is that this issue has taken seven years to manifest.....

You are trying to understand is culture, but is he doing the same for you? It sounds to me like you have tried many times to gently explain the situation, but to no avail. Compromise goes both ways.

Turning down a sexual overture from one's partner is always a tricky business. There is so much more tied into it than just sexual desire.

My instincts tell me to tell you to just sit down and talk to him about it, but it looks like you have already done that. If he really is as wonderful as you say he is (and I'm not saying that he is not) then he should be as interested in "pleasing" you whether it be through sex or not having sex.

These things can take a long time to work out. Just because someone doesn't understand today, doesn't mean that they won't understand tomorrow or months or years from now. Look at the big picture.

You have made the effort to find out about what is culture says on this matter. Is he as willing to find out about what your culture says on the matter? Much of it could be a security thing. "If she doesn't have sex with me everyday, then that means she doesn't love me/want me/care for me etc. etc. " Maybe HE talked to a North American (or European) woman on the subject . If he did that, hemight begin to believe you and be more reassured.

I don't envy you your situation (been there, done that), but I do hope that things work out.

Rose

[pasha]

bloom is off the rose so to speak.....too bad after 7 years. I wouldn't expect things to get a lot better frankly. How about going to a counselor together?

Best of luck, P

[simpson Homer]

Im 100% agree with Timex,

If you answer the questions it can help.

Because if you guys are not leaving together and you don't see him so often. also is he taking any Medicine?

Homer Simpson

[mountainfrog]

Well, have you ever seen a cock (rooster) on a dung heap, flapping HIS wings and
crowing out loudly?
If so, you need not worry: a Dominican man does not need counseling because HE and God (in that order) have decided that ...
Panzanelle, please accept your destiny.

[Tony C]

"My Dominican boyfriend (of 7 years) and I have different attitudes about sex. He has a higher libido than me (though mine is healthy), and thinks that we should have sex everyday or at least go no more than two mornings without sex. He also thinks I should never say no. He thinks that Dominican women never say no to their husbands or partners, and that they always "want it"."

Amazing what some people consider a problem!

As I see it you have two choices.....Either kiss him goodbye or do the right thing and spread-um!

If you think you have a Healthy libido then why don't you want to have sex every day?

[Talldrink]

Most men think about sex 24/7 and who wouldnt want to satisfy their sexual needs everyday? However, some are more sensitive to their partner's needs and feelings more than others. I can truly tell you, I've lived your situation, and it is not fun.

I hated saying no, then I felt guilty, then this and then that, it was always uneven. The biggest problem was that this was a EVERY SINGLE NIGHT! I hated it! and the more I thought about it, the less spontanous it got and the less I wanted it. So I feel your pain.

Another point: Regarding the DR women you spoke to, they say yes everytime b/c they are scared their man will stray if they say no. They feel they have to 'get off' regardless of how - of course, the cant help, thats why they have a wife - every night by any means necessary, but the wife does the work, not him.

I know that it is frowned upon to generalize, however, my country men truly believe that if one woman does not satisfy him, he has the right to get another or many more women. In fact, I find that the Dom women take cheating as part of life.

It is so common to hear the guys saying that a woman cannot cheat but it is ok for them to get another woman. The double standards live and thrive there, they say that it is not the same for men and women and this is life. I say this from experience, from hearing it over and over again, from both men and women and from living the culture my entire life.

Here's one example: I told my friend one day that I thought our friend's man was cheating, she tells me, "So, what man doesnt? Thats her man and she knows that other woman, we just act like we dont know" Not only did they both know, but they accepted it like this is the way is supposed to be!!

Ok, so the point of my post is that he may be trying to tell you that If you dont put out, it is his 'right' to get help from outside.

Like other people say here, those are my 2 centavos...


P.S. Im not saying the cheating thing relates to your man in particular, but the thread did ask about Doms men's attitude about sex....

[rafael]

I have been living with a dominican woman for almost 2 years. Prior to that I was married to a dominican woman.

In neither case had either one of them EVER said no. Now, mind you I am not talking about them succumbing to pressure from me.I have absolutely ZERO interest in making love with someone that isn't as into it as I am. If a woman, any woman says no thanks, I don't ask again. . . .I just go to sleep.

I would also say that 80-90 percent of the time the women initiate sex. I like sex, but will not die if I don't have it every night. . . . . . .sometimes I am not so sure thye feel the same way!

I would much prefer 3-4 times per week with someone that wanted it badly than 7 times per week with someone "doing her marital duty". . . . .luckily for me I have the best of both worlds;-)