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  #21  
Old 10-10-2005, 07:39 AM
La flor y nata
 
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Lesley D Level 2 (83)
Default Chirimoya

It is interesting that you bring up this thread again because I am currently reading a linguistic resource about Spanish spoken in the USA released this year and it covers false cognates, extended cognates, loan translations and loan words. It's a very thorough resource and of course interesting. These are topics that I need to stay on top of as well as the terminology and examples.

Anyway thanks for adding to the list of false cognates and indeed those on your new list are ones that are commonly used incorrectly. The resource clearly outlines USA word meanings and the traditional variants. For example carpeta as mentioned in my post # 8 was on the list of many false cognates whose meaning in the USA although incorrect is accepted instead of the traditional variant alfombra. What I mean is carpeta= folder or file. In the USA carpeta= carpet, rug. This area of study is a branch of linguistics known as 'sociolinguistics' thus referring to characteristics of speech of a group, region, etc. influenced by sociocultural factors.

One aspect that I disagree with though from a linguistic point of view is those who know the true meaning of carpeta why would they use the false cognate over alfombra. It's different if the speaker does not know that the Spanish meaning is not equivalent to the English meaning. All of this contributes to the disintegration of language in my opinion.

Yesterday I read an interesting essay by Pedro Juan Gutiérrez about the evolution of the way people speak and one of the last phrases caught my attention:

Es así. El idioma evoluciona. Hoy empleamos un lenguaje más relajado, fresco y sabroso que en siglos anteriores, tanto semántica como gramaticalmente.

I think that this statement is so true and very evident when one hears how Spanish is spoken in the USA- a prime example.


LDG.

Last edited by Lesley D; 10-10-2005 at 01:45 PM.
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  #22  
Old 10-10-2005, 09:55 AM
Dominisueca
 
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mariel Level 1 (10)
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if someone says to me "pasame la carpeta" what i'll understand s/he wants is the folder, not the rug.

about "que tenga un buen dia", i've always said "que pase un buen dia".

Last edited by mariel; 10-10-2005 at 10:00 AM.
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  #23  
Old 10-10-2005, 10:17 AM
La flor y nata
 
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Lesley D Level 2 (83)
Default Mariel

Of course you will understand the difference however the point I am making is that outside of the USA carpeta does not mean rug. This is purely a sociolinguistic issue (not to mention a false cognate). If the meaning has transcended then it's due to this phenomenon.

LDG.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mariel
if someone says to me "pasame la carpeta" what i'll understand s/he wants is the folder, not the rug.

about "que tenga un buen dia", i've always said "que pase un buen dia".
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  #24  
Old 10-10-2005, 10:23 AM
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Chirimoya Level 4 Chirimoya Level 4 Chirimoya Level 4 (276)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mariel
can't "preservativo" be translated as "preservative" in the sense of the chemical preservatives in food?
It is used, but I believe the correct term is 'conservante'.
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  #25  
Old 10-10-2005, 12:40 PM
Dominisueca
 
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mariel Level 1 (10)
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lesley: of course i understood what you meant. i was just expressing my vast knowledge of spanglish hehe.

chiri: weird, i've always seen in food packages "sin preservativos ni colorantes" (or something like that). ah well, i learnt something new today
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  #26  
Old 10-10-2005, 03:44 PM
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mofi Level 1 (10)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesley D
Nice list. Some of the false cognates made me laugh. I don't know if you have ever been to Miami but whenever I go I hear examples of the words you gave used incorrectly of course. A common error from your list is "carpeta". I give up. There is no hope. Also certain phrases that are a literal translation from English to Spanish have become acceptable. For example "Have a nice day" in Spanish spoken in the USA. Take a wild guess.


LDG.
Can I guess??? Tengas un buen dia?
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  #27  
Old 10-10-2005, 03:49 PM
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mofi Level 1 (10)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesley D
Of course you will understand the difference however the point I am making is that outside of the USA carpeta does not mean rug. This is purely a sociolinguistic issue (not to mention a false cognate). If the meaning has transcended then it's due to this phenomenon.

LDG.
This is common among people who are either A: Not native spanish speakers or B: Don't have a great education. I can say I am guilty of this.......When I don't know a word I turn and english word into a spanish word....Most people can usually figure out what I am talking about.
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  #28  
Old 10-10-2005, 03:50 PM
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mofi Level 1 (10)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mariel
lesley: of course i understood what you meant. i was just expressing my vast knowledge of spanglish hehe.

chiri: weird, i've always seen in food packages "sin preservativos ni colorantes" (or something like that). ah well, i learnt something new today
I have to agree with you. Never heard that word used for condoms.....Everyone I know says condones
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  #29  
Old 10-10-2005, 10:55 PM
La flor y nata
 
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Lesley D Level 2 (83)
Default Mofi

Both terms are used.

I was hoping that the dictionary would elaborate more on the usage of each term but both online dictionaries that I normally consult and a manual reference have condón as a synonym of preservativo.

LDG.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mofi
I have to agree with you. Never heard that word used for condoms.....Everyone I know says condones
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  #30  
Old 10-11-2005, 04:05 AM
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juancarlos Level 1 (10)
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Both terms are used but, traditionally, preservativos was the only word I knew for it. It was only after I had been in the US for many years when I heard condones used to mean preservativos. In Mexico they say preservativos, but condones is on the increase. In Cuba, I only heard preservativos. I don't like the word condones. My own personal prejudice, I suppose. I think the word condones is of a more recent origin or usage.
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