Dominican Cigars?

[emendoza]

We'd like to buy cigars while we're in the DR. We'll be in Santo Domingo a couple of days (in Samana the rest of the time). I assume the better place to buy is Santo Domingo? Anyway, I'm looking for Cifuentes y Cia. Partagas 1845 & Camacho Liberty Anniversary. Any suggestions on where to buy--preferably in or near Colonial Zone? If you know what fair prices would be, that would help too. Thank you.

[angie35]

Sorry for jumping in on ya thread, but me too. I'll be in Playa Dorada in the North and would like Cohibas. Anyone know how much they are and the allowance to take back to the UK?

Thanks
Angela

[Hillbilly]

RE: COHIBAS: There are no legitimate Cuban Cohibas in the country that I know of. DO not EVER believe what they tell you in any cigar store.
I will tell you of two places where you might find good cigars in Santo Domingo:
1) In Hotel Lima there is a cigar store.
2) Next to the Metro Station near Winston Churchill Ave, in back of the big shopping mall there is a pretty good place.
And, just maybe, Uncle Tom's down on Isabel la Católica. But no Cubans.
Also, there is a cigar kiosk in the Nacional Supermarket which features some good, honest cigars from the major houses, including, I think, Cifuentes.

On the North Shore, there are no really good cigar stores. And there are tons of fakes. You might try the little store in the Commercial area of Playa Dorada. Again-NO CUBANS. If you want cigars come to Santiago and visit La Aurora or another factory.

I am trying to find out if there is anybody that is importing Cubans. The Bizarro Café used to have a great selection of Cubans but they stopped doing that a while back. I think I'll give them a call.

TTYL

HB

[juancarlos]

Since Cuba and DR have normal trade relations, I don't understand why there are no Cuban cigars for sale there. They are available in Mexico and Europe, why not DR? Of course, Cuban cigars are by far superior to any others. I know that Santiago is the tobbaco growing region there and that they probably do make good cigars but, even in Cuba, cigars that are made using leaves from plantations outside the Vueltabajo district, are not that good and would probably compare in quality to Dominican cigars. The secret of the most famous Cuban cigars, the ones Cuba exports, is that the leaves come exclusively from that small area in western Cuba whose soil and climatic conditions are uniquely fit for growing the best tobacco in the world. Cuban cigars are VERY expensive. Few people can afford to buy a whole box of Cohibas, let alone afford a Cohiba, or any other Cuban brand, habit.

[ERICKXSON]

Originally Posted by juancarlos

Since Cuba and DR have normal trade relations, I don't understand why there are no Cuban cigars for sale there. They are available in Mexico and Europe, why not DR? Of course, Cuban cigars are by far superior to any others. I know that Santiago is the tobbaco growing region there and that they probably do make good cigars but, even in Cuba, cigars that are made using leaves from plantations outside the Vueltabajo district, are not that good and would probably compare in quality to Dominican cigars. The secret of the most famous Cuban cigars, the ones Cuba exports, is that the leaves come exclusively from that small area in western Cuba whose soil and climatic conditions are uniquely fit for growing the best tobacco in the world. Cuban cigars are VERY expensive. Few people can afford to buy a whole box of Cohibas, let alone afford a Cohiba, or any other Cuban brand, habit.

__________________________________________________ _______________
DOMINICAN TOBACCO IS FAR BETTER THAN IT'S CUBAN COUNTERPART
ask around...................

[juancarlos]

Originally Posted by ERICKXSON

__________________________________________________ _______________
DOMINICAN TOBACCO IS FAR BETTER THAN IT'S CUBAN COUNTERPART
ask around...................

Oh, since when? I do not need to ask, I know Cuban cigars are STILL the best and so does the whole world. That's why Cuban cigars are the most expensive and sought after of all cigars in the world! Of course, not all Cuban made cigars are that good: regular or bad cigars never leave Cuba. Outside of the Vuelta Abajo region, the leaves are just average. Perhaps Santiago tobacco in the DR may equal the quality of tobacco grown in Central Cuba or in areas around Havana, but in Cuba those leaves are mostly used for second class cigars and cigarettes and they are not exported. You should visit the western most part of Cuba, about 100 miles west of Havana, and see for yourself. They are the tallest tobacco plants I have ever seen and the leaves are the widest and healthiest in the world. Those plants are grown under a sea of chesecloth and this type is known as tabaco tapado, the best for cigars. However, if you travel 10 miles otuside this district, the quality of tobacco suffers, even if the same seed is used. Within the same province, there are differences in soil.
Actually, the famous tobacco growing region encompasses only three municipalities: San Luis, San Juan y Martinez and Pinar del Rio. The best plantations are in San Luis and San Juan. Most of the plants are still grown on private land but since the goverment sets the price way below market value, and by law they can ONLY sell to the goverment, the growers do not receive the money they are entitled to for the good care and hard labor they put into this very delicate and time consuming effort. Almost needless to say, most Cubans have never smoked a Cohiba or even a Romeo y Julita because they are export products and their price is definitly out reach for most people there.

[ERICKXSON]

Originally Posted by juancarlos

Oh, since when? I do not need to ask, I know Cuban cigars are STILL the best and so does the whole world. That's why Cuban cigars are the most expensive and sought after of all cigars in the world! Of course, not all Cuban made cigars are that good: regular or bad cigars never leave Cuba. Outside of the Vuelta Abajo region, the leaves are just average. Perhaps Santiago tobacco in the DR may equal the quality of tobacco grown in Central Cuba or in areas around Havana, but in Cuba those leaves are mostly used for second class cigars and cigarettes and they are not exported. You should visit the western most part of Cuba, about 100 miles west of Havana, and see for yourself. They are the tallest tobacco plants I have ever seen and the leaves are the widest and healthiest in the world. Those plants are grown under a sea of chesecloth and this type is known as tabaco tapado, the best for cigars. However, if you travel 10 miles otuside this district, the quality of tobacco suffers, even if the same seed is used. Within the same province, there are differences in soil.
Actually, the famous tobacco growing region encompasses only three municipalities: San Luis, San Juan y Martinez and Pinar del Rio. The best plantations are in San Luis and San Juan. Most of the plants are still grown on private land but since the goverment sets the price way below market value, and by law they can ONLY sell to the goverment, the growers do not receive the money they are entitled to for the good care and hard labor they put into this very delicate and time consuming effort. Almost needless to say, most Cubans have never smoked a Cohiba or even a Romeo y Julita because they are export products and their price is definitly out reach for most people there.

You win.....

[Hlywud]

Cuban cigars are a wanted commodity only because of the embargo, sure they are available in many countries but it is the one they are not available in that drives the market, they certainly do not match the quality of a good Dominican cigar.
I also have been to Cuba many times and seen the fields and the tents, purchased and smoked there wares and in my opinion there is no comparison with a good Dominican cigar.

mi dos peso's

[Hillbilly]

This is an unending argument. There is no clear-cut answer. Juan Carlos is partially correct in that people do want to smoke Cuban cigars and will pay major money for the fun of doing so. That said, people like James Suckling from Cigar Aficionado magazine, perhaps their most imformed writer, reports that because of the tremendous pressure being put on the factories to produce the famous brand cigars that they sell in Europe (Partegas, Cohiba, Romeo & Julieta, H. Upmann, Ramón Allones and so forth) quality control is way down and tobacconists are reporting as much as 35% of cigars not being smokable because of manufacturing defects. None of the top Dominican products (Same names plus Arturo Fuente) come close to this level of rejects. Suckling says that 3% of non-useable cigars is typical from the DR.

Now there is no doubt that the tobacco from Vuelta Abajo is outstanding, and it is because of a curious combination of soil, sun and rain. The tobacco from Santa Clara is a clear second. Both tobaccos are used in the most famous Cuban brands, in order to achieve the desired blend of flavors, just like no Dominican cigar is made from tobacco from just one region.

Going to the root of the post

Because Cuban cigar production is already over-extended, it is very difficult for a new market to be opened. And the local Dominican cigar market is very small. Dominicans smoke Marlboros (UGH!) not cigars. And the legitimate Cuban cigars face incredible competition from fakes, either locally made or imported from Cuba. And YES, Cuba makes fake Cubans!! So few people can afford the prices. And the Cuban authorities got rid of the traditional factory codes and date of manufacturing codes so there is no reliable way to tell the genuine from the fakes, except by ultraviolate light and a microscope.

In the DR it is difficult,even, to sell real DOMINICAN cigars. There are so many fakes. I went to a store in Cabarete and there was just a bunch of junk cigars that are considered, here, to be third rate-at best. And no Cubans. No "real" Cubans, that is.

BTW, before you start to do battle, remember that the Central American producers are making a bunch of really fine cigars, like Padrone, C.A.O., Perdomo and others. Many, many people would take a Padrone Aniversario over most Cubans any day (well, except for Monte #2, or Cohiba Lancero)..And the Padrones are just as expensive. Many of my cigar buddies in the States import their Cubans by the box from Holland and Spain....and get what they want, when they want it!

HB

[juancarlos]

"Many of my cigar buddies in the States import their Cubans by the box from Holland and Spain....and get what they want, when they want it!"

Hillbilly, that demonstrates that in spite of everything you have mentioned, Cuban cigars are still worth importing from far away places. I know many Cuban planters are manufacturing their own cigars in Central America, particularly Honduras and Nicaragua and they are probably good and they use cuban seeds. Still, nothing like the real Cubans. The same thing applies to DR. They do have good tobacco, but I will never admit ANY tobacco is better than the one grown in Vuelta Abajo. I know you are right about rejects of Cuban cigars, I have read the same thing and I believe Cuban authorities are to blame.